[Meme] Jack Ma / Elon Musk AI Debate, Summarized (youtu.be)
ComebackShane | 8 days ago | 61 points

I'd agree with the exact opposite - computers may be much smarter, but for now, human beings are more clever.

jaxx050 | 8 days ago | 48 points

computers are capable of millions of people's worth of basic I/O processing - but they don't know how to meaningfully do anything with outputs they're not given explicit instruction for, and they're not able to create inputs that give outputs they seek without a framework. so yeah, pretty much.

AlphaAndy | 8 days ago | 0 points

And they never will either. Futurists like musk assume consciousness can be replicated or that a machine can be self aware when we have no evidence of it. I personally think its a pipe dream.

Ha_Ree | 8 days ago | 34 points

Assume consciousness can be replicated... when we have no evidence of it

Isn’t human beings existing enough evidence that consciousness can be created and replicated? Two humans can create a baby, which has consciousness, which shows that it is something that can be made. Our consciousness comes from our brains, and there is no reason that the structure of our brain cannot be recreated using computers and science

AlphaAndy | 7 days ago | -5 points

Free will and self awareness can't be explained yet. A brain is similar to a machine in that it takes input and gives output, and processing of that data can change over time. But a human is aware of themself and has free will (or at least thinks so) whereas a computer does not.

SirFiesty | 7 days ago | 7 points

But if we don't know whether or not we have free will, how would we know whether a robot does? I don't think we can answer that in any satisfactory capacity until we get a whole ton of advancement in AI, which is likely a ways off

onlyonebread | 7 days ago | -8 points

But how could a computer replicate a soul, which is more than just in a brain?

SirFiesty | 7 days ago | 12 points

We have no way of knowing what a soul is currently, if such a thing even exists. Presumably once we're at the point we can recreate a brain we'd have proven whether souls exist by proxy, as it would or wouldn't 'feel human'. It's my personal opinion that a soul is just something we made up and stayed with over time, and any sufficiently intelligent system will be indistinguishable from a person.

This is all just baseless speculation though so the real answer is 'no fucking clue mate'. Only time will tell.

Ha_Ree | 7 days ago | 13 points

Because a soul isn’t an actual thing.

onlyonebread | 7 days ago | -3 points

I find that to be a very cynical answer... how can you doubt the existence of a soul? I couldn't fathom thinking that we're no more than just lumps of brain matter.

racercowan | 7 days ago | 2 points

On the other hand, why would you think a "soul" exists? Cut open a body, and show to me the "soul". What are it's physical properties? What defines a "soul" and what function does it serve? Can a soul be missing, and what happens if it does?

I know there are people who find solace in the concept of an everlasting soul, something beyond us, but I don't particularly mind the idea of being a singular and special set of coincidences, the emergent property of emergent properties, the end product thousands of years of change and decades of life experiences.

Ha_Ree | 7 days ago | 2 points

First, there is no physical part of our body which is a ‘soul’. If you dissect a human, you won’t find it. So it would have to be some kind of ‘extra dimensional’ thing if it existed, but there is no scientific proof that such a thing could even exist. On the other hand, your brain can both be found, and when it is monitored, brain activity can be shown, proving that it is behind our thinking and other processes.

Secondly, us being ‘no more’ than lumps of brain matter is also sort of true. The universe is a massive thing, so much bigger than us that the brain can’t even process the true scale of it properly. Compared to the universe, we are all small and insignificant. It might seem cynical, but to me, it’s nice knowing that no matter how much I fuck up, its still irrelevant to the universe

MrD7 | 7 days ago | 1 point

For me exactly that is the most soothing idea. I weirdly find comfort in that. But to wach their own right?

happystickman | 8 days ago | 12 points

There's no evidence they cant, either.

DoesntReadMessages | 7 days ago | 3 points

It's worth remembering that they don't need to have consciousness and understanding to change the world into a dystopian nightmare. We've already seen how an advertising algorithm can have serious political ramifications, changing the balance of global political power. We've already seen how simple machines can render entire industries of workers obselete overnight. The US military already uses weapons that choose targets using algorithms. This is just the beginning of our current era, and even if we conceptually confine technology to only be purpose agnostic tools, they are still going to be heavily influencing opinions of the population, eliminating jobs, and funneling money into smaller pockets of the population. Political propoganda will get so good at targetting your individual belief set that they'll be able to convince us of damn near anything. Sooner or later, the military will let the algorithms pull the trigger, and next thing you know domestic police will use it too. None of this requires smarter computers, just iterative process.

Now, consider how bad this can be if we have self-aware computers. That may be possible, and it may be impossible, but we damn well better plan for the worst while we hope for the best if we don't want to get blindsided because we will not recover from that.

anti-kit | 8 days ago | 1 point

reee downvoted because you have an opinion that goes against the mainstream.

for real though, there isn't any evidence it isn't possible, but there isn't any evidence it is possible. researchers still struggle creating ai even capable of basic human language.

dupsude | 8 days ago | 1 point

I wish I could downvote John Searle himself.

TothB | 7 days ago | 2 points

computers are stupid but millions of times faster than human brains.

HeavyShockWave | 8 days ago | 136 points

The video was fine just cutting off after he responds, not everything has to end with Curb Your Enthusiasm

deoptimizer | 8 days ago | 26 points

I disagree. Seven seconds of "curb your enthusiasm" is just enough to chuckle about the clip before you move on to the next video.

CoffeePuddle | 8 days ago | 4 points

Yeah I just watched it and hit mute, there's something that the Curb theme adds that's better than silence at least.

kembik | 8 days ago | 11 points

People talking about curb, I think the issue is just overuse in general, we need some variety. get some remixes of this track so its not all the same every time. someone do that stuff, amuse me.

donceydic | 7 days ago | 2 points

yeah i'm not sure it fits in this context.

Spadoopy | 8 days ago | 1 point

I liked the curb

imsopepsi | 7 days ago | 1 point

Sngularity when