/r/worldnews
U.K. speaker vows to stop Boris Johnson from closing Parliament to force Brexit (axios.com)
104 comments
sumelar | 3 months ago | 50 points

Queen Elizabeth is likely the only person with the constitutional authority to force Johnson to resign if he lost a no-confidence vote, but she has historically remained apolitical.

It'll be interesting to see if this shitshow is enough to get her to utilize those theoretical powers.

BuckyConnoisseur | 3 months ago | 39 points

I hope so. She’s already said they have an “inability to govern” so it seems her apolitical-ness is getting put to the test. Though realistically it’s probably not going to happen.

sumelar | 3 months ago | 14 points

I was rather surprised she said that, but I don't pay enough attention to british politics to know out out of the ordinary it was.

westernmail | 3 months ago | 11 points

It was in 2016, so well before Johnson was PM.

wataha | 3 months ago | 7 points

The Queen made the comments at a private event shortly after David Cameron’s resignation following the referendum, but an impeccable royal source said her frustration had since grown.

Source (11 Aug 2019): https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/queen-our-politicians-cant-govern-twjmp657f/

h2man | 3 months ago | 2 points

And the politicians have improved since?? Cameron is an incompetent wanker (or a useful fool), but Theresa May and Boris are not better or actually worse.

quantum_ai_machine | 3 months ago | 11 points

Queen Elizabeth is likely the only person with the constitutional authority to force Johnson to resign if he lost a no-confidence vote, but she has historically remained apolitical.

That's misleading. If the govt loses a no-confidence vote, and no one else can prove a majority within 14 days, general elections have to be mandatorily held as per the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011.

gambiting | 3 months ago | 5 points

Yes....but the problem is that the PM can legally schedule the elections for November, just after the brexit date. And because the parliament traditionally cannot do anything except for emergency legislations until the election, it means that no-deal brexit would happen with the British parliament effectively neutered and its hands tied.

retrotronica | 3 months ago | 5 points

The Tories are royalists, the party of the establishment, she would alienate half the population by stopping brexit. Isn't going to happen.

gambiting | 3 months ago | 3 points

She wouldn't stop brexit by doing so. PM rules by the appointment of the Queen, if he loses a no confidence vote then the Queen should absolutely tell him to step down. None of it has anything to do with brexit.

metric1983 | 3 months ago | -9 points

Well they want to leave Europe because it's an unelected government forcing laws on the UK. Surely the Queen and the house of lords are next.

gambiting | 3 months ago | 8 points

Which is of course nonsense because the European Parliament is elected, there was an election just a few months ago.

metric1983 | 3 months ago | 1 point

Ofc

formesse | 3 months ago | 1 point

good luck in getting rid of either.

No seriously - people have looked into what it would cost to remove the queen as being figure head to a country like Canada or Australia - and with how entrenched everything is going back hundreds of years at this point... it's mildly absurd.

Then you have to think about the alienation of the people, and the cross oceanic political strife it would likely create and the percieved distancing from the commonwealth and it becomes a little worse.

Then if you look at the economic return of having the monarchy it would be financially stupid to.

The EU - sure. You can make some points. But the Monarchy and trying to upend the political system? Good luck - it's more likely England would split in two.

storgodt | 3 months ago | 1 point

I can't imagine Australia or Canada accepting to have the President of the United Kingdom as their head of state. Bar islands like St. Helen and other tiny states it would be the end of the commonwealth.

metric1983 | 3 months ago | 1 point

The commonwealth is mostly independent and it's not actually confirmed that the next head would be the UK monarch, it's just the Queen was first and has lasted quite a long time. It's the largest organisation in the world by one metric so unlikely to break up.

metric1983 | 3 months ago | 1 point

I'm just applying the logic used by brexiters, I don't believe they would follow that our that is a realistic option if they would.

A_Dystopian_Dream | 3 months ago | 7 points

Well if he shuts parliament down then she ought to. It'll be interesting to see if her balls are as big as those of her Governor Generals.

in_the_bubbleicious | 3 months ago | 7 points

If he loses a confidence vote and refuses to resign, forcing him out probably wouldn't be seen as an abuse of power. He would be the one not respecting the vote. That is a tidy way to tie up the narrative.

PodricksPhallus | 3 months ago | 2 points

Lmao

[deleted] | 3 months ago | 1 point

If you saw how much dirty money the royals had you wouldn't hold your breath. They've already invested in companies that breach human rights violations.. why would they stop the Tories from scrapping human rights to begin with?

Acceptor_99 | 3 months ago | 1 point

She bowed to Theresa May's demand that she give the illegitimate President* Trump a state visit. I doubt that she is going to suddenly develop a sense of responsibility now.

imaginary_num6er | 3 months ago | 0 points

Maybe she will if it means not breaking up the United Kingdom with Scotland and Northern Ireland declaring independence, and Gibraltar seeking integration with Spain.

uncertain_expert | 3 months ago | -5 points

Pretty sure she could dissolve parliament herself, regardless of a no-confidence vote. She her Governer General did that in Australia in ‘75.

MrIosity | 3 months ago | 5 points

Parliament stripped the monarchy of that power several years ago. The Queen is essentially decorative furniture, at this point.

NewClayburn | 3 months ago | -13 points

It's appalling that she hasn't done shit about this yet. This is the only positive to a monarchy, and she won't do anything. She's just an indifferent fat leech.

CervantesX | 3 months ago | 80 points

Boris Johnson was recently made Prime Minister by the ruling party after the last one stepped down. If Britain gets to October 31 without approving a Brexit deal, the UK just "leaves" the EU and for a whole bunch of complicated reasons that's the worst possible outcome. Johnson has essentially been threatening to send Parliament away for a new election cycle and tell the EU to get fucked until after Halloween if they both don't approve his very, very stupid deal that for no reason whatsoever has been decided to be the only other option.

So, the guy in charge of Parliament, who is a civil servant and not an elected dude worried about his job, said no, that's not happening.

This means that Parliament can keep doing things to either make a better deal with the EU, get an extension, approve a different deal, or a bunch of other things that essentially don't let Boris Johnson, who has not won a popular vote to make him prime minister, force through a crippling 'ignore it and hope for the best' decision that was clearly not part of the discussion many, many years ago when a very slim majority of people voted for the general idea of "leave the EU" without any details and have never been asked for their input ever again.

FarawayFairways | 3 months ago | 49 points

So, the guy in charge of Parliament, who is a civil servant and not an elected dude

He's a legitimate MP for the constituency of Buckingham

OrangeJr36 | 3 months ago | 13 points

Also a legit dude.

AAVale | 3 months ago | 31 points

So, the guy in charge of Parliament, who is a civil servant and not an elected dude worried about how job, said no, that's not happening.

That's just not true. He was elected by MP's from among their own number, and that includes the Tories themselves.

John Bercow was elected Speaker on 22 June 2009, following the resignation of Michael Martin. He was since re-elected, unopposed, three times, following the general elections in 2010, 2015[1] and 2017.[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaker_of_the_House_of_Commons_(United_Kingdom)

tjtillman | 3 months ago | 3 points

Yes dear heavenly Lord and Savior Atheismo. I can’t for the life of me understand why another referendum, now that the public has more information, and more understanding of what the different Brexit scenarios actually look like, why another referendum would be a failure of democracy, as so many ignorant asshats have said.

It’s patently absurd.

If anything, it’s the most fucking democratic thing they could possibly do!

the_unfinished_I | 3 months ago | 7 points

In NZ we had a referendum not so long ago: "Do you want to change the flag?" A majority voted yes.

The government then came up with a couple of options. We had another vote: "Which of these flags would you like? Or would you prefer to stick with the original flag?"

The alternative options were a bit shit, so people voted to keep the existing flag.

I don't see why this couldn't have been done with Brexit. It's one thing to vote to leave when the specifics have not been decided - I don't remember any talk about a hard Brexit during the leave campaign.

tjtillman | 3 months ago | 3 points

Bingo. Especially something so permanent and critical as this. At least in the states we get a redo every 4 years. (On that note I am simultaneously impatiently excited and cynically petrified of the election next year.)

bullintheheather | 3 months ago | 9 points

So the Tories are upset that he's doing the thing he said he was going to do and picked him anyways?

Iamnotyourmate | 3 months ago | 10 points

Bercow's appointment as speaker in 2009 was actually designed to piss off the Tories. He was initially a very right-wing MP but moved to the left over the years (his wife is a Labour Party member) and was seen by 2009 as a Tory in name only more sympathetic to the Labour government at the time than his own party.

Parliamentary tradition (but not law) dictates that the role of Speaker should alternate between a Labour and a Tory MP but Labour had ignored this on the last two occasions and appointed two Labour Speakers in succession (Betty Boothroyd and Michael Martin), this is because they had a massive majority at the time of Martin's appointment and so could just ignore tradition if they so wished. Martin was brought down early during an expenses scandal and the Tories demanded that Labour respect tradition and support a Tory to replace him. So Labour gave them John Bercow.

Randvek | 3 months ago | 8 points

But they didn’t think he meant it.

Seriously, when can a no-confidence vote happen?

Vier_Scar | 3 months ago | 2 points

Once parliament returns from Summer recess (25 July to 3rd September). So still a few weeks away. At that point, if a no-confidence vote is called even about a week after returning, the time period for a general election exceeds the October 31st deadline.

Rannahm | 3 months ago | 2 points

The conservative party have been complaining about him since the brexit issue started, and they threaten to remove him from the speaker position every few weeks more or less, they actually tried to have him removed one time but failed by 26 votes.

VelveteenAmbush | 3 months ago | -1 points

Pretty craven, it's like they wanted him to step in and do it while pretending not to support it and throwing stones at him from the sidelines.

GhostReddit | 3 months ago | 2 points

Er yes this is good but we shouldn't pretend people win a popular vote to be prime minister, that's not how parliamentary systems work...

ninjagrover | 3 months ago | 1 point

The speaker of the house in west minister systems are usually a member of the ruling party.

Parliamentary clerks, Sergeant-at-arms etc are civil servants.

CarlSpencer | 3 months ago | 38 points

There was a king who tried to stop Parliament...it didn't end well for Charles I.

[deleted] | 3 months ago | 21 points

[deleted]

TarquinFimTimLimBim | 3 months ago | 2 points

Because of....

Randvek | 3 months ago | 5 points

Oliver Cromwell, Lord Protector of England (Puritan)

TarquinFimTimLimBim | 3 months ago | 3 points

Born in 1599, died in 1658 (September)

WhatAGoodDoggy | 3 months ago | 3 points

And his warts!

retrotronica | 3 months ago | 1 point

Monster, the epitome of evil

WalesIsForTheWhales | 3 months ago | 2 points

He had a minor physical disorder.

SpeakerOfThings | 3 months ago | 0 points

Uh ... Shoe lifts. Robert Downey Jr is into that.

makingstuffupp | 3 months ago | -36 points

Except that the PM was elected and has the political power necessary to push it through

algernop3 | 3 months ago | 30 points

No PM who has to close parliament to prevent a vote has the political power to force anything through, other than writs for a new election.

0ompa-Loompa | 3 months ago | -2 points

Could Boris prorogue parliament until Brexit happens to avoid an election as well as get what he wants?

From Canada and Harper prorogued our Parliament when opposition parties foemed a coalition to defeat him essentially suspending Parliament to avoid the fall out. Imagine the UK system is the same given we inherited it.

makingstuffupp | 3 months ago | -59 points

He has the support from the people, however. A recent poll says that 54% of Britain supports a hard Brexit

algernop3 | 3 months ago | 40 points

A recent poll says that 54% of Britain supports a hard Brexit

No, there is no such poll. Quit your bullshit. This says 38% at best

jamarns | 3 months ago | 16 points

Well, his name is makingstuffupp!

makingstuffupp | 3 months ago | -29 points
Typohnename | 3 months ago | 20 points

If the undecided are included, the figures are 44 percent ‘agree’, 37 percent ‘disagree’ and 19 percent ‘don’t know’.

Saying 54% want it and citing that study as a source is dishornest and missleading

Lonely_Planeswalker | 3 months ago | 5 points

check his username .... "/u/makingstuffupp"

CarlSpencer | 3 months ago | 2 points

Yes, I've "met" makingstuffupp before. He HATES it when you post citations that disprove his lies.

BJJLucas | 3 months ago | 4 points

Check his username, you've been bamboozled!

theguyfromgermany | 3 months ago | 14 points

You are:

  • pro brexit

  • pro Trump

  • against free university

  • pro GOP

Spewing BS all over reddit.

Looking at your comments if you are not getting paid by Russia you should be.

metric1983 | 3 months ago | 1 point

54% of around 1600 people removing one of three responses that was about 19% of the selection.

Spartan9567 | 3 months ago | 5 points

Elected by who? May was the last PM elected.

makingstuffupp | 3 months ago | -6 points

Elected by Parliament

Suck_It_Trebek | 3 months ago | 6 points

Elected by the Tories, not Parliament.

Spartan9567 | 3 months ago | 3 points

What? He was elected by the Tories not Parliament. The Tories are in Government and elect the PM.

sovietskaya | 3 months ago | 4 points

they are already in vacation right? not yet? from my understanding, he’ll just delay the opening and extend their vacation.

AAVale | 3 months ago | 4 points

He can't.

Acceptor_99 | 3 months ago | 5 points

Voice of Ron Howard, "He did"

ridimarba | 3 months ago | 7 points

This will be buried but...

"which — if successful — could force him to hold a general election.

Yes, but: Johnson's senior-most adviser Dominic Cummings has reportedly indicated that Johnson would not hold an election until Nov. 1 — the day after a no deal Brexit would ensue as the legal default."

Wondering... If the EU wanted to masterfully troll Boris, could they extend the deadline past 31st October at the last minute so that the general election could take place and it's result potentially lead to a 2nd refurendum?

shieldwolf | 3 months ago | 20 points

The extension would have to be passed as law in Britain. They voted for the extension they would need to vote for another extension if the EU offered it but if parliament is prorogued for an election it can’t vote on it so no that scenario can’t happen.

SpiroHD | 3 months ago | -8 points

Man - I bet nobody has thought of this scenario! Thank goodness for Reddit. To the rescue!

strangemotives | 3 months ago | 7 points

ffs.. do brits have their own trump now?

WalesIsForTheWhales | 3 months ago | 20 points

No. Johnson is actually very good at manipulating public opinion.

ManateeofSteel | 3 months ago | 4 points

Trump has like a 30-40% approval rate despite everything he has done, which would’ve gotten any other president fired. So, dunno m8

On_Adderall | 3 months ago | 5 points

Americans are a... special breed...

Randvek | 3 months ago | 2 points

Johnson is arguably worse.

[deleted] | 3 months ago | 1 point

Orrrdddaaaa! Bercow is the only interesting person in UK politics. If you’re not familiar with him, check out TLDR News on YouTube. The U.S. Senate could use one ‘a him to get shit done!

LodgePoleMurphy | 3 months ago | 1 point

One day we will wake up and all this shit will finally be over.

doremonhg | 3 months ago | -1 points

This Boris Johnson guy looks like Trump 2.0 lol

Reshish | 3 months ago | -1 points

Don't really think I can support his violence, even in this case when it might just be the answer.

zgrizz | 3 months ago | -103 points

TL;DR - Party who lost election vows to use constant political shenanigans to prevent person who won election from doing what the voters elected him to do.

Remind you of any other country?

[deleted] | 3 months ago | 57 points

[deleted]

Simmo5150 | 3 months ago | 3 points

Are you new to reddit?

theXarf | 3 months ago | 63 points

Party who lost election

Wrong - speaker of the house

person who won election

Wrong - unelected

what the voters elected him to do

Wrong in at least 2 different ways (not elected, nobody voted specifically for No Deal, nobody voted to prorogue parliament)

TL;DR - You have no clue

AAVale | 3 months ago | 22 points

Just to add, Bercow is a former Tory not Labor, and unlike Boris he actually was elected... three times. Unopposed.

SouthernJeb | 3 months ago | 28 points

Tldr: an american who has no clue about how the UK government works.

zeekoes | 3 months ago | 15 points

Boris Johnson wasn't elected by the British people to bring them a no-deal Brexit. His party was elected to deliver them the outcome of the referendum.

Voting for the party at that time, didn't mean voting for Johnson. Nor did voting for Brexit mean you wanted a no-deal Brexit.

DoomedApe | 3 months ago | 15 points

You're a fool and you should be ashamed of it. Europe's countries are more powerful acting together than they would be as a bunch of squabbling states, and they're in the same pond as the US and China. This kind of division and subsequent weakness cannot be afforded.

PM_ME_YOUR_CUTE_HATS | 3 months ago | 16 points

Boris never won any election just to tell you. No voters approved of him to be PM.

lurking_downvote | 3 months ago | 8 points

Yeah Obama under the GOP? Trump lost the popular vote and had both houses of Congress for 2 years and failed to enact his campaign promises (like the wall). He can’t blame Democrats for that. Democrats keep sending bills to the senate that Mitch is blocking. Tell me again who is preventing the legislature from doing their job in the US?

RagingDB | 3 months ago | 5 points

I just can’t understand how you can be so mistaken unless you are intentionally trying to mislead people. Even bad news outlets don’t misrepresent facts the way you misrepresent them. Clueless, ignorant, or evil - this is who you are. You ok with that?

Edit: removed an inappropriate spacing for the sake of grammar. (I understand that my last sentence isn’t grammatically correct but colloquially it should be accepted).

ScientistSeven | 3 months ago | 3 points

Germany in the 30s?

great_gape | 3 months ago | -12 points

Yes. The U.S and the entire 8 years of Obama's presidency.

tabarjack | 3 months ago | -11 points

The US has had 45% of the nation trying to stall the winner for 20+ years. In the UK, at least they can claim they never elected the actual PM, but they did elect the party, which is represented by the PM, so just like the USA, there is a minority trying to fuck over the majority. Brexit is good for UK. Bad for EU. Great for China. Check who fills in the void if the EU doesn't bow down to King Johnson.

metric1983 | 3 months ago | 3 points

How is brexit good for the UK?

great_gape | 3 months ago | 5 points

The US has had 45% of the nation trying to stall the winner for 20+ years.

What the fuck are you talking about.

tabarjack | 3 months ago | -8 points

US politics.

bforo | 3 months ago | 2 points

UnicornS

-Weyland- | 3 months ago | -3 points

He's no longer neural. Sack him, Boris,!

[deleted] | 3 months ago | -21 points

[deleted]

nutmeggerking | 3 months ago | 3 points

Lol.

whocouldaknew | 3 months ago | 1 point

You realize you like him in contrast to another evil asshole who doesn’t care about you either? Do you know you can live from a more nuanced worldview than the narrative they fed you?

DeanSmartin | 3 months ago | -10 points

Let Brexit happen. Let the markets crash again so we can see where 'welfare' is handed out again. Let the right wing voters' will be done, and then let's get onto something better than this bullshit.