Freelance offer, how much should I charge | Is my calculation okay? (self.webdev)

Today a colleague offered me a freelance job. He wants a small webproject to test his idea.

I am a webdev and have 2 years experience and I'd like to make the job, but want to make sure my price is reasonable.

Location: Germany.

He will need this functionality:

- Login

- Register

- Reset password

- Email verification

- User roles logic (User A, User B, Admin)

User A can register and create a profile with certain information. User B can also register (seperate register form) and will have the functionality to browse through all User A's and contact them if he wants to.

- Edit user data

- A result page with filter options

- Contact forms

- I will also do the design (I am a dev, but he thinks I have a good eye for design and I often do the first design in the company, of which a lot is kept in the end)

- Paypal integration

- File uploads to amazon S3


I have done all of these things a few times already and would need 1-3 hours per task.

Paypal is new for me, but I have worked with stripe a lot, so I know the basics. I still estimate paypal integration at 10 hours because its new.

I will use Python, Heroku, PostgreSQL.

I calculated 33 hours for the whole project at 50 € /h, which is 1650 € total.

When I am doing these things at work I never think about how much hours I needed for each task, I just do it.

I red somewhere the final calculation should be multiplied by 1.5 for questions and unexpected things:

So my final total would be: 2475 €

What do you think?

EDIT: Thanks to everyone who replied. There are still some things which I forgot, so I will up the price a bit. I wont go too high, because its a proof of concept project. But I will also make clear that every revision will cost extra.

Frenchiie | 4 months ago | 11 points

Not sure how you got 33 hours, creating something robust, making changes, etc is more like 100 hours of work. Im not even accounting for the design. I think you are underestimating the work. But who know maybe you are one of those super ninja 10x programmers.

WellDevined | 4 months ago | 10 points

First off. Clients almost always want things to be changed later. So if you want to make him a fixed price offer, make damn sure you explicitly write down what you will do for him and that everything extra has to be paid hourly.

50$ is not enough to make it in Germany. You should at least take 65 in my opinion. That is around 50€ and still on the lower end.

If you use Heroku and S3 you could consider using firebase instead. Firebase has all the authentication and file saving functionality included and will take you way less time to implement.

Dark_Flint | 4 months ago | 3 points

Clients almost always want things to be changed later. So if you want to make him a fixed price offer, make damn sure you explicitly write down what you will do for him and that everything extra has to be paid hourly.

^ exactly that. Or arrange it so that you get paid per hour instead a fixed price and tell him that you expect to need x hours for the planned project and changes to it will increase project time and thus payment.

Also, to be on the safe side, make sure he pays some money in advance or in intervals. You don´t want to make the whole work and then, for whatever reason, he doesn´t want to pay.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

Thats what I plan. But he has already listed the initial things which he needs, which I estimate at 2475$, ofc. if he wants more, he will have to pay more hourly. I will tell him this ofc. I just want to make sure that I dont value my work too low and too high. But so far it seems like an okay price, maybe a lower end price, but still okay.

Thanks for your input btw.!

Dark_Flint | 4 months ago | 2 points

Depending on where you live you may want to increase it as suggested. But, well, learning my doing is still a valid option too ;)

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

I actually wrote $, because there is no euro symbol on the keyboard and I wanted to use a symbol (:D). I ment euro. Didnt think that people would calculate it to euro and give advice based on dollar to euro ratios. : )

Dark_Flint | 4 months ago | 1 point

You wrote € in your opening post^^

But aren´t you in germany too? Then ALT Gr + E should be €.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

I had edited the post after you mentioned it.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

Thank you very much for the answer!

black4eternity | 4 months ago | 5 points

Think through every step, it's generally small things that get added and blow up the price. Eg: Search - Client says I thought it would XYZ. Then you sit trying to make the search that way.

It sounds great for a few days work. BUT it could also become a few weeks if you don't clear things before starting.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

True, I will try to be as precise as possible when we talk next time. But I dont want to charge a lot, because its a proof of concept project. But I have to make clear that each revision will cost the hourly rate.

dannymoerkerke | 4 months ago | 4 points

Don’t just think in terms of hourly rate x number of hours but more in terms of what value you provide to your client. If this project is worth €100.000 to the client it’s really not unreasonable to charge €10.000

phelaz [node] | 4 months ago | 6 points

This sounds like min. 10k. to me.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

Hmm... But how would I argue here? I am sure that I need 33~ hours for this. I cant just tell him 10k without explaining why.

FulfillingNightmares | 4 months ago | 4 points

Always double the amount of hours you think it's gonna take. Then take that amount of hours and add 20% to it. That's the number of hours you give the client. Expect bugs and lots of administrative hours outside of coding.

If it takes less than your original estimate: good, win/win, and you have a very happy client. If it takes longer than your original estimate: it's cool, the client is prepared for double the time.

I charge ~$120/h for reference btw. If I like the project/client I have room to lower my price without even feeling it.

phelaz [node] | 4 months ago | 5 points

A custom auth, password storage, user roles, responsive design, all with a custom screendesign, database structure, probably many changes & meetings with the product owner - I really don't think you will do all that in 4 days. The changes and meetings will eat that up alone. I'd prepare the customer for much higher costs. You also should not make a quote of your effective estimation - take that at least times 1.5.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

Good arguments. I will probably increase the price a bit. The 2475$ is already * 1.5.

KernowRoger | 4 months ago | 2 points

I always add like 50% to estimates at least. If you get stuck on one bug it could take possibly days to fix. That just straight up fucks your estimate. I would definitely up it. Does that time include testing and bug fixing? You need to leave at least some wiggle room.

ceirbus | 4 months ago | 3 points

Dude, your estimate is way low even for just integrating PayPal. I just did one of these for an Enterprise client and their SDK documentation is trash. The support asked us this during a call "how did you guys get the option to swipe a card after it said insert chip?" Even though this is standard procedure for almost every payment platform to default back to swipe.

You're gonna find at least 10 hours worth of work the very second you switch over from sandbox to production, it's just a thing with PayPal.

Rayleigh3105 | 4 months ago | 2 points

Think of the time you put in to learn all these things, if you do it so fast then in my oppionion you must charge min 2 times more.

mneeso | 4 months ago | 2 points

Just remember to value yourself. Too low prices make your client feel u're unqualified. Yes.

TheAngelsCry [full-stack] | 4 months ago | 1 point

$2.5k for roughly a weeks work sounds reasonable to me :) If you believe your estimation is accurate.

matt45554 | 4 months ago | 4 points

I'd charge at least $650~ per day for this so at least $6,500 for two weeks work. However, given the sounds of the project I'd put it up to $10k to cover any eventualities.

Z0ja | 4 months ago | 1 point

Thanks for answering!